Whitby Town Is Falling Down

This article, Whitby Town Is Falling Down – , was originally published in 2010. Although some of the neglect has now been rectified, much has not, and every month more neglect of our beautiful town comes to light. This page aims to serve as a diary of neglect of our town by Scarborough Borough Council.

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Whitby Town Is literally falling down whilst Scarborough Borough Council stand by and watch. Our beautiful town, loved by so many from across the UK and worldwide, has been subject to underinvestment and a defunct repair and upkeep policy from Scarborough Borough Council that many parts of the towns heritage (our heritage) finds itself on the brink of collapse into the sea.

Rumors are rife that poor drainage systems around the Abbey Headland are to blame for recent landslips at Aelfreeda Terrace and the area just below St Marys Church.

Recent emails to Real Whitby from local campaigner Tom Broderick have highlighted how dredging may have caused the collapse of the harbour wall piling of the east side harbour close to the swing bridge.

Although the harbour wall has now been replaced, and an independent report has outlined the collapse was due to dredging, the bill for this neglect is expected to be met from the public purse at an estimated cost of 1.2 – 1.8 million pounds (All for the sake of several yachting births).

Collapse Of Harbour Wall Near The Swing Bridge – Feb 2009

A walk along the towns once beautiful piers tells another heartbreaking story. The east pier has been neglected for so long that many of the features of the pier now find themselves in a state beyond repair. The piers capstans and other timberwork is now rotted beyond repair due to lack of maintenance. No amount of paint will ever put this right.

Rotting Capstans On Whitby’s East Pier

Rotting Capstans On Whitby’s East Pier Summer 2011

The east pier bridge giving access to the outer pier extension is missing and has been for far too long. Looking onto the outer extension itself reveals yet more neglect. The upper deck handrails are heavily corroded as are the old wooden lifebelt boxes. A look to the lower deck of the pier reveals that the handrails are corroded beyond repair with many being close to collapse, whilst several have already gone. The electric cables for the end lighthouse are corroding fast and it surely wont be long before tragedy strikes here.

Whitby East Pier Bridge

East Pier Bridge Still Missing Summer 2011

East Pier Lower Deck Handrails, Corroding Fast Summer 2011

East Pier Lower Deck Handrails – Gone Summer 2011

East Pier Lifebelt Box – Rotting Away On A Corroding Handrail.Summer 2011

East Pier Handrails, Not Bolted Down Or Painted Summer 2011

The majestic east pier lighthouse which once  protected the towns fishermen and mariners from the rocks on Whitby Scaur, now finds itself boarded up. The windows are cracked or worse still boarded up, and its woodwork hasn’t seen a lick of paint in a very long time. The pointing around the windows has fallen out and it surely wont be long before the windows follow suite.

Whitby's East Pier Lighhouse Boarded Up

Whitby’s East Pier Lighthouse Boarded Up Summer 2011

Whitby's East Pier Lighhouse Glass - Cracked

Whitby’s East Pier Lighhouse Glass – Cracked Summer 2011

Whitby's East Pier Lighhouse Glass - Cracked

Whitby’s East Pier Lighhouse Glass – Cracked Summer 2011

Whitby east pier lighhouse, No Pointing And Window Frames In State Of Disrepair

Whitby east pier lighhouse, No Pointing And Window Frames In State Of Disrepair Summer 2011

Corroding Sign Posts Summer 2011

Corroding Sign Posts (See Above Picture)Summer 2011

A walk along old Church Street and into town, and its not long before you witness more neglect. The woodwork of the Dolphins around the swing bridge are also rotted well beyond repair, and a film of oil on the water surface below suggests that the bridges hydrolic system may also be past its best.

Rotting Dolphins Around Whitby Swing Bridge

Rotting Dolphins Around Whitby Swing Bridge Summer 2011

Rotting Dolphins Around Whitby Swing Bridge Summer 2011

Rotting Dolphins Around Whitby Swing Bridge

Rotting Dolphins Around Whitby Swing Bridge Summer 2011

Rotting Dolphins Around Whitby Swing Bridge

Rotting Dolphins Around Whitby Swing Bridge Summer 2011

Rotting Dolphins Around Whitby Swing Bridge

Rotting Dolphins Around Whitby Swing Bridge Summer 2011

If you venture down pier road and examine the fish quay area around the ice house and oil births, neglect is once again highly evident. Many of the supporting wooden uprights are bashed or broken and one begins to wonder what is holding up the structures above.

Broken Uprights Below Whitby's Ice House

Broken Uprights Below Whitby’s Ice House Summer 2011

Broken Uprights Below Whitby's Ice House

Broken Uprights Below Whitby’s Ice House Summer 2011

Broken Uprights Below Whitby's Ice House

Broken Uprights Below Whitby’s Ice House Summer 2011

Walking further still, this time onto the West Pier reveals a slight improvement with handrails and benches in a better state of repair, but dig a little deeper and you start to see the true story once again.

The West pier outer extension is now totally closed to the public, and like the east pier it is rumored locally that the bridge may be pulled down.

The lighthouse keeper on the west pier reports that when it rains, the water comes in through the roof and down the stairs in a torrent flowing over the wiring for the lighthouse electrics which have long since ceased to function.

Whitby's West Pier Lighthouse - A Torrent Comes Down The Stairs

Whitby’s West Pier Lighthouse – A Torrent Comes Down The Stairs Summer 2011. West Pier Lighthouse Closed for fear of collapse 2012

West Pier bottom deck of the outer extension, where much of the handrail is either corroded or missing and 75% of the piers lower deck is closed to everyone including sea anglers who used to flock to the pier in search of a fish or 2 for their evening meal.

75% Of The West Piers Lower Deck Is Closed To The Public.

You dont have to look far on Whitby’s West Pier to realise that neglect from Scarborough Borough Council has brought the pier into a state of disrepair which you would not expect to find in one of the UK’s leading tourist destinations.

For those visitors and residents of the town with a little more energy, a climb up the towns infamous 199 steps and into the St Mary’s Graveyard above may be on the cards. But be warned, once up there you may struggle to find a seat to rest your weary legs as the benches around the graveyard are also in a poorly maintained state.

Broken Benches In St Mary's Graveyard At Whitby

Broken Benches In St Mary’s Graveyard At Whitby Summer 2011

Real Whitby Magazine Asks WHY ??

Related Reading

Whitby Towns Gallery Of Neglect – All Pictures Taken 2009 To 2011

146 Responses to "Whitby Town Is Falling Down"

  1. Nigel Ward  February 28, 2011 at 7:10 pm

    Great work, Tom! Great work, Glenn!

    Now people can see what we have been banging on about. Left to rot.

    Now let’s see some pictures of Scarborough Harbour. Allan Roberts can tell you some astonishing stories – and they are all true.

    Cllr Peter Popple has got a job on his hands. He better get it right or Whitby is up a certain well-known creek, and I don’t mean the Esk!

    Reply
  2. Andrea Smith  March 1, 2011 at 8:31 am

    I hadnt realised things were as bad as this. Thnkyou for taking the time to get the photos and writing this article which has brought things to the attention of those who follow this website.

    Reply
  3. TTD  March 1, 2011 at 8:35 am

    Its about time Whitby had its own council with real control of the towns expenditure. The local elections are not far away now, so maybe its time to send the conservatives a strong message that we are not happy with their lack of investment in Whitby.

    Reply
  4. James Davies  March 1, 2011 at 8:38 am

    As a long term visitor to Whitby through the summer, I am astounded to see the state of the town these days. Whitby has seen a mass increase in tourism over the last 20 years and the council must have seen a large rise in the public coffers, so where has all the money been spent ?

    Reply
  5. Bob Roberts  March 1, 2011 at 10:27 am

    Great insight into the ethos of SBC and how they value Whitby, its not a great deal different in Scarborough it has to be said. The only investment SBC make nowadays is in car parks or revenue collection.
    Scarborough Harbour fairs no better than Whitby, rotting or broken infrastructure that takes years to remedy, if at all. Little to no consideration paid to stakeholders who actually care what impression the state of the place gives to tourists, that in addition to what facilities that although paid for in levies actually give any value for money. This includes both staff and elected members it has to be said when it comes to the VFM issue.
    That said when our new brush under the guise of Head of Tourism takes over, will we fair any better. Only time will tell on that one, meanwhile sceptism prevails and I hope that I’m proven wrong.
    Keep up the good work and its a bloody shame Scarborough doesnt have an equivalent website. (Food for thought anyone?)

    Reply
  6. Benq23  March 1, 2011 at 12:16 pm

    worrying pictures there lads
    I think its an outrage that our historic structures are left to rot and in the end quite literally fall into the sea from neglect
    I like many recall using the east pier when it was accessible….always a welcome break from the overcrowded west, I think the two piers show the two sides of whitby, the west showing the modern and tourism heavy side of the town and the east looking across the scaur to saltwick showing the natural and untamed side
    such a shame that they (the council) simply refuse to maintain such structures as the pier and the lighthous….as has been said in this thread before, where does all the massive revenue from the carparking (and car ticketing) go?

    Reply
  7. Bassman  March 1, 2011 at 12:47 pm

    A recent email passed to Real Whitby regarding the Swing Bridge Oil Leak.


    I refer to your e-mail regarding oil leakage at Whitby Swing Bridge.
    I am advised that following the Council’s contractors, ‘Fairfields’ ,visit to site a short while ago they reported a leak on a hydraulic pipe in the West Side HPU and recommended that all the pipes be renewed ,which we did a week or so ago.The leaking pipe did, unfortunately ,result in an amount,albeit small ,of hydraulic oil drip from the bridge engine room.
    Currently there is a small problem with a pipework manifold which is weeping slightly in the West Side HPU for which instruction have been issued to be renewed at the earliest opportunity ,although this leak is captured in the drip trays which the Bridge men have been asked to mop out with sorbent until the manifold is renewed.None of the above is prejudicial to the operation of the bridge.Hope this clarifies the situation.
    Regards
    John

    John Riby
    Head of Technical Services
    Scarborough Borough Council
    t: 01723 232423

    Reply
  8. Jon Risdon  March 1, 2011 at 12:49 pm

    It seems difficult to believe that this dilapidation is the result of passive neglect, but if it is wilful, where’s the benefit? Is it purely that capital expenditure has been given higher priority in our rapacious consumer society, over maintenance which could ensure, improve, and maybe even maximise honourable & justifiable revenue?

    Reply
  9. The Man In The White Suite  March 1, 2011 at 12:51 pm

    Good work Glenn , but let’s not get carried away , Scarboro is an absolute **** hole, I would rather live in libya.

    It would be great if Whitby was not controlled by SBC, but do you really think it would be that different, those who think it would be a bed of roses are living in cloud cuckoo land.

    Reply
  10. Sharron Fox  March 1, 2011 at 1:05 pm

    Lets not get sidetracked into the old Scarborough Versus Whitby campaign. It doesnt matter who is in charge of the council, so long as the council invest money into the town, which evidently they have not. I would like to say a big thankyou to Real Whitby for bringing us stories like this. For a long time now, Scarborough Borough Council aided by the Whitby Gazette have portrayed anyone who speaks out against the council as the local idiot, or worse still a trouble causer. Stories like these show what people like Peter Budd are campaigning for. The man is not half as daft as the council and the scourge of local news, the gazette, would have you believe. Keep up the good fight boys and long live Real Whitby.

    Reply
  11. Marion Sythe-Jones  March 1, 2011 at 1:09 pm

    Has anyone spoken to Whitby Town Council about these matters ? Whitby Town Council should be taking copies of these pictures to SBC and asking for the problems to be put right.

    Reply
    • Frank Chalmers  March 3, 2011 at 11:16 pm

      Oh, people have asked alright.

      You should come to some of the Council meetings. They are laughable in the extreme. Having been once or twice myself, I was disgusted at the lack of any sort of competence amongst many there, who call themselves ‘Councillor’.

      I have asked why no one does anything. I never get a straight answer, or I get “we’re on to it”, sort of answer, which is a non-answer.

      It is simply disgusting.

      Reply
  12. Peace of mind  March 1, 2011 at 1:52 pm

    The headcount on any given day of the year of visitors to the town seems to increase every year, this means increased wear and tear to everything in the town. Why does this not equate into investment in keeping the towns structures safe and sound?

    With regards to the comment above asking if anyone has spoken to Whitby Town Council, tonights meeting at Pannett Park (Art gallery) has agenda item 12. MOTION – THE EAST AND WEST PIER STONE LIGHTHOUSES – To consider current state of repair and their future conservation.

    Meeting starts 6.45pm and is open to the public

    Reply
  13. Nigel Ward  March 1, 2011 at 2:01 pm

    I make the point again.

    Whitby Town (Parish) Council is just that – a PARISH Council. It is constrained by the Local Government Act 1972 to having powers ONLY OF PERSUASION with Scarborough Borough Council – no ‘powers’ at all.

    As Peter and I have been pointing out for years, the only prospect of Whitby escaping its present predicament is as part of a democratically elected North Yorkshire Moors National Park Authority – an authority which is at present appointed, not elected.

    It can be done – under the auspices of 3 Acts of Parliament. Learn more here:

    http://www.freewhitby.org.uk/

    In the meantime, SBC will continue to maximise revenue from Whitby whilst minimising investment. It stops when the people say it stops. Start shouting!

    Reply
  14. peter anderson  March 1, 2011 at 4:51 pm

    my family originate from whitby since 1126 as a young person in the 60′s/70′s many a summer was spent in my family’s home town.everything in those day’s was smart ,painted ,repaired, and maintained.untill the great reaper arrived sbc.i did not go to whitby for 18 years (2009)i was in disbelief.the state of the harbour,both peirs,lighthouses,harbour wall between the fish and tate hill peir (with water poring through it) the total decay of the bridge dolphins, the inscure railings on the 199 steps(stairs). i despair as i know the people of the town do.i ask all whitby people to support the endevours and hard work of everyone that is fighting the criminal neglect of whitby by scumbrough brough council.

    Reply
  15. Margaret Urwin  March 1, 2011 at 10:20 pm

    It’s true that SBC gain nothing from allowing Whitby to deteriorate in this way. They know that they reap a huge income from Whitby and one would expect that they would attempt to keep the place in as good repair as possible. It was Whitby which was voted Best Seaside Resort in 2006 but I have to say that Scarborough appears to be in a much better state of repair, so it ‘s obvious that they are spending the bulk of the money there. SBC must surely be having a twinge of concern at the thought of losing Whitby to The North Yorkshire Moors National Park Authority…perhaps that might make them perk their ideas up. Personally, I think they’ve had their chance and Whitby needs to be free of them for good.

    Reply
  16. p.boiston  March 3, 2011 at 5:21 am

    The councillors should be ashamed at the state of a beautifull histoic fishing port that is being washed into the sea with every storm and high tide.
    What would Captain Cook think if he came sailing into his home port and saw all that rotting timber and collapsing harbour walls.
    Where is all this lottery money going to and how come this bunch of millionaires running the country can send millions of foreign aid to other countries who are building bombs and have a space research program.
    Some body needs a good kick up the backside all this unemployment builders ect
    cant get a job its shamefull.

    Reply
  17. The Man In The White Suit  March 3, 2011 at 6:33 am

    I will ask the question again, where are all of you at the local meetings? Do you really think you will get anywhere by just posting on here or writing to your mp ( he will use your letter to light his Cuban cigar)

    Reply
  18. p.boiston  March 3, 2011 at 9:17 am

    To the man in the White Suit. I havnt attended a meeting because i live in Stockton on tees.
    I know that writeing to your ministers and Mps does work because i have proof that they do listen.
    I am new to this computor game and what i have found is that a lot will sit on the fence and let others do the work.
    Leave me the address of the councillor at Scarbrough who you have written to and i will also send a letter. Yours sincerly P.B

    Reply
  19. angela  March 3, 2011 at 12:11 pm

    Yes, TMITWS, lets have the address for the letter(s) you have sent, we can send them our letters as well on the same subject….power in numbers- the more people highlighting a problem the better….

    Reply
  20. p.boiston  March 4, 2011 at 8:00 am

    To anybody who wants to write to Scarbrough Council heres the address.

    Scarborough Borough Council,
    Town Hall St Nicholas Street,
    Scarbrough,
    North Yorkshire,
    YO11 2HG.
    Tel 01723/232323.

    Dont forget a stamped addressed envelope for your reply.
    They need to be seen to be doing something or they will be out of a job.

    Reply
  21. Cliff Street  September 8, 2011 at 12:01 pm

    With reference to Nigel’s post of March 1st there is no way that joining an authority based on the National Park would improve Whitby’s lot. Even if the, not inconsiderable, problems could be overcome it would only take us from the frying pan to the fire. Look at the map of the National Park. The boundary already skirts Whitby. There would be no geographical, political or other factor that would make Whitby issues more significant.

    The park covers a vast area taking in large parts of Hambleton DC, Redcar and Cleveland, the parishes west of Scarborough, Ryedale DC including Helmsley and Kirbymoorside and includes Sutton bank and an area almost as far as Thirsk.

    You can’t seriously believes that Whitby would be able to muscle-in and take over the show. In truth the town would be a relatively small extension of the park. It is highly likely that matters would be made worse.

    The Localism Bill just may give an opportunity for change bit I’m more than a little sceptical about whether that will be beneficial.

    Reply
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  23. Ben Quinn  September 11, 2011 at 11:50 am

    with regards to closure of the west pier, I think this one may be the straw that broke the camels back in the sense of what whitby as a whole is ready to put up with from the constant failures of our local and national government to safeguard our national landmarks. I can be sure the tower of london isnt going to fall into the thames any time soon, neither are the houses of parliment or god forbid our monarchs houses…yet Whitbys historical sites and landmarks are disposable aparently

    I will certainly be voting anything but goodwill come election time as he has failed so many times to even recognise whitby as part of his areas of concern

    Reply
    • J.G.Harston  April 2, 2012 at 2:11 pm

      But Mr Goddwill is the MP not a councillor, he’s nothing to do with the council and council matters.

      Reply
  24. admin  September 11, 2011 at 11:53 am

    http://www.writetothem.com/

    Reply
  25. Harry cook  September 11, 2011 at 12:26 pm

    the state of whitby over the last ten years has drasticly declined,
    i am appauled at the lack of repair to the basic structure of some of the towns important assets,

    as a regular visitor to fish from shore ,pier ,or boat,
    and as a sightseer my wife and myself see all most monthly delapitation

    to a beautiful town ,it is sole destrying at times ,
    will the powers that be please try and improve things at the greatest of speed.

    Reply
  26. barry  September 11, 2011 at 2:33 pm

    When is the repair of West Pier going to begin , This month , Next month , or Never . I brought some visitors from abroad to visit Whitby , to say the least after all they had heard about it , they were not impressed . Whitby town is falling down .
    A date when the repairs will begin please .

    Reply
    • Tom Brown  September 13, 2011 at 10:00 am

      Oh Barry how about 2099?

      Reply
  27. Neil Inglis  September 11, 2011 at 7:39 pm

    Whitby west pier now closed,is it a coindcidence that summer is over and all the kids are back to school,holiday makers gone home,and the winter fishing season is about to start. Was the pier not in the same condition in july and august,seems that they kept it open for regatta etc and then closed it when everyone has gone home.I went fishing last Sunday and there were at least fifty people fishing,I dont think people realise how many people come to Whitby to fish and how much revenue it produces,and now both piers are gone tackle shops may struggle and people will go to other venues to fish.Not only is this bad for the town where do junior anglers and disabled anglers now fish .Lets hope they fix them soon.

    Reply
  28. Tom Brown  September 13, 2011 at 9:57 am

    When you think of the £millions Scarborough has milked out of Whitby Harbour and the many £millions of grants from Europe that should have been allocated to Whitby you’d think we had a case but we don’t seem to have any route of redress unless somebody can come up with something

    Reply
  29. Andy Mann  September 13, 2011 at 4:24 pm

    As a regular visitor to Whitby, I can only comment on my own observations of it over the last 50 years. I’ve always loved Whitby and can never stay away for more than a month or so without being drawn back there.
    From the age of seven and right through my teenage years and my twenties, all I ever wanted from Whitby was to get on either of the piers and spend hours fishing and watching all the activity in the harbour. When I wasn’t fishing in Whitby, I fished from Saltburn pier or South Gare instead which are both closer to where I live in Middlesbrough.
    Although I did a lot less sea fishing during my thirties and forties due to the fact that I discovered coarse fishing, my preference returned to sea fishing in the last few years, especially after getting my first kayak.
    So, even though I have regularly visited Whitby without ever fishing there for nigh on twenty years, I feel saddened and angry that both piers have been left to rot and are now both inaccessible to anglers.
    Although recently retired, I’m only in my mid fifties and I’m fairly fit, so I’m lucky that I have the time to be able to pursue my re-discovered love of sea fishing from my kayak whenever sea conditions allow, but if it wasn’t for the piers at Whitby in particular, that seed would never have been sown and I would probably never have become an angler.
    As a kid, I was never happier than when we had a family day out at Whitby. I would head straight for Whitby Angling where I would buy a carton of fresh mussel and fish into the harbour off a jetty near to where the Visitor Centre is now on New Quay Road, and catch billet and the odd flattie on a handline. Then I graduated to the fishing area next to the swing bridge and then onto the piers.
    I can’t say that I’ve seen too many changes over the years around the harbour area, but I cannot understand why the piers and their wooden extensions have not been kept in good order or renewed whilst Saltburn pier and the surrounding area has had been completely restored.
    In stark contrast to Whitby, I’ve just visited Scarborough this weekend for the first time in 10 years, and I was impressed by all of the improvements and new developments in both the North and South Bays. It would appear that a lot of money has been spent in upgrading this popular resort over the last ten years as it certainly needed it the last time I was there and the overall shabby state of the place was the reason I stopped taking my family there.
    However, I was slightly disappointed that access to the piers for angling appears to have been restricted somewhat from the last time I was there. I still managed to catch a couple of mackerel from the East pier yesterday evening though and was pleased with that.
    I was talking to my brother-in-law about my observations and how much appeal each resort attracts to holiday makers and day tourists. He is a businessman who works for a successful telecommunications company, and he told me that he has attended several meetings in the last 12 months between his company and S.B.C. in which he was astounded by the shambolic lack of understanding and communication between senior members of the council regarding the financial situation and spending plans of each others departments. One of their leaders actually attended one particularly important meeting in a stained white shirt and sporting a Micky Mouse tie. Not only was he late, but he had come totally unprepared. When his colleagues explained the agenda to him, they found that he had not received or read any of the internal communications between their various departments, and had not brought the required documents to the meeting. The meeting had to be curtailed and another one arranged. Following that, two further meetings have had to be cancelled in similar circumstances due to the shortcomings of the council in providing their own senior members with accurate and required information to enable them to negotiate contracts which they themselves were in a hurry to complete as it was in their own interest to do so because they were losing money by delaying the deal.
    I must say that this, along with other examples of incompetence that I’ve read about, is enough to make my blood boil, so I can only imagine how fed up Whitby folk and pier anglers must be with S.B.C.
    It definately does appear to me that most of the taxpayers money has, and is being spent on attracting visitors to Scarborough at the expense of Whitby’s status, and unless this imbalance is addressed quickly, Whitby is going to need private investment from somewhere to restore it to it’s former glory.

    Reply
  30. admin  September 13, 2011 at 5:04 pm

    Why is this being allowed to continue ?? News today that the harbour board are to evict fishermen from Church street births so that new pontoons can be built for yachters.

    Reply
  31. Francis L. Chalmers  September 13, 2011 at 9:03 pm

    It’s most amusing to see that Real Whitby announced the neglect of the pier so long ago, and only now are we seeing SBC spring into action with a “routine inspection” and “safety closures”…

    What arrogant and pathetic scum they have shown themselves to be.

    Do they really think that we’re going to sit idly by forever?

    The time has come to act ladies and gentlemen… Time to march on the Town Hall in Scarborough, and demand action from those that claim to represent our interests across the Borough, not just Whitby, but Scarborough and Filey too!!!

    Reply
  32. Francis L. Chalmers  September 13, 2011 at 9:04 pm

    It’s most amusing to see that Real Whitby announced the neglect of the pier so long ago, and only now are we seeing SBC spring into action with a “routine inspection” and “safety closures”…

    What arrogant and pathetic scum they have shown themselves to be.

    Do they really think that we’re going to sit idly by forever?

    The time has come to act ladies and gentlemen… Time to march on the Town Hall in Scarborough, and demand action from those that claim to represent our interests across the Borough, not just Whitby, but Scarborough and Filey too!!!

    Reply
  33. Andy Mann  September 17, 2011 at 6:40 pm

    People have been complaining for 10 years about the state of Whitby’s East pier, but what good has it done ?
    SBC have deliberately allowed both piers to slowly deteriorate over the years and if they had kept on top of the repair work required each year, they wouldn’t now require major expensive restoration.
    Instead of maintaining the piers by spending a little amount on the important parts from year to year, all they have ever done is to paint over the cracks to give the illusion that they have been looked after.
    People are not just sad and angry that the piers are now both closed, their anger is being directed at the culprits who were trusted with their upkeep. ie. SBC.
    Meanwhile, a disproportionate amount of the council spending has gone into mis-managing Scarborough’s sea defences, restoring the Spa complex and building improvements in the North Bay area. The people of Whitby and it’s visitors have every justification to denounce the lack of action by SBC in maintaining their piers and many other of the towns attractions. It is nothing short of disgraceful and there are plenty of us who want the world to know about it.
    For years people have been asking nicely for SBC to allocate Whitby it’s fair share of the coffers, but it has been largely to no avail. That is why they must be taken to task and exposed for their neglect of Whitby. As diplomacy hasn’t worked, it has to be worth trying to SBC into action.

    Reply
  34. Tom Brown  September 17, 2011 at 7:15 pm

    Remember John Riby did not resign after the Scarborough’s sea wall fiasco.He had ‘CLEAN’ hands But he cares for his job so might not blow the whistle. There is a possibility however that he cares for Whitby. He obviously was not in the SBC corruption loop.
    The ‘Common Purpose’ rule of misrule looks like the EU STRATEGY is coming g to an end.
    So John join us.

    Reply
  35. Colin Winspear  September 19, 2011 at 6:38 pm

    May I ask when some of these photos were taken? I see at least one of them dated 2009. As far as I know, the harbour wall has been sorted, At least it was today when I looked, as well as the supports beneath the ice house. So those photos are irrelevant now. I might have a wander round tomorrow and see if I can find anymore. I agree with the sentiment, but can we use images that are a little more up to date? Or is it the Whitby Way to exaggerate problems to make a point?

    Reply
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  37. Tom Brown  September 23, 2011 at 11:23 am

    So we were warned! just watch they said, just watch the likes of Plant and Kenyon muscle in re the piers. Well I hoped and suggested that we all rally on the West pier to show our solidarity on Sunday the 25th. but no, The Scarborough and Whitby Labour party has decided to hijack the event by staging INSTEAD the same rally a week later. This would make it look like all the attendees are Labour supporters. No! it was not their initiative to rally, it will have the effect of ruining the entire thing. I have always been an independent councillor and a plague on both their houses I say. So, regardless, on Sunday the 25th at 2pm I will be on the West pier. Alone if I have to be.

    Reply
    • Gerald Dennett  September 29, 2011 at 11:03 am

      When did “Scarborough and Whitby Labour Party decide to hijack the event”, Tom? Please tell me. I am amazed that you, who is clearly not a member of the Party, should have more information than me. Did you attend the Campaign Day that discussed this issue? Did you attend the GC meeting that gave its full support to the campaign being organized on Facebook? I do not recall seeing you at the Whitby Branch Meeting, unsurprisingly. Did you obtain Labour Councillors’ signatures for the Whitby Gazette petition? You clearly know as much about this as SBC does about the conservation of steelwork. I expect your apology.

      Reply
  38. Colin Winspear  September 23, 2011 at 2:11 pm

    I have just had another browse thru the above photographs, and I have spotted something that concerns me. The two regarding the collapse of the wall near the swing bridge. one shows the collapse itself, the other the dredger. Taken in 2009. If you look very closely at the Dredger photo, the legend beneath claims it to be dredging PRIOR to the collapse. However, look very closely and you will see that the wall is repaired, and there are supports sunk for the new pontoons? Is this a genuine mistake, or is it a deliberate attempt to mislead the reader, to create tension? Do you expect us to take things at face value?

    Reply
  39. DKP  September 23, 2011 at 2:37 pm

    Why not go read the engineers report and the council report, mate? Might prevent you coming on here making an ass of yerself. Caused by dredging too deep and too close to the wall. There in black and white. Same with that legal bod. Or ask the bridgemen.

    Reply
  40. Colin Winspear  September 23, 2011 at 3:30 pm

    I realise the collapse was due to the dredging,, but look at the photograph mate, It was taken after the wall was repaired, and supports sunk for the new pontoon.. Yet claims to show the dredging PRIOR to the collapse.

    Reply
    • Nigel Ward  September 23, 2011 at 6:35 pm

      Notwithstanding your determination to find fault, Colin, let us keep our attention on the following key points:

      1) The state of the Harbour generally is the result of massive long-term negligence and incompetence.

      2) The responsibility for that does not reside with Real Whitby.

      3) The responsibility does not reside with the Whitby Gazette.

      4) The responsibility does not reside with me – or my colleagues.

      5) The responsibility resides SOLELY with SBC (since 1st April 1974) – now under the auspices of the (pilot) Whitby Harbour Board – on which local interests are poorly represented, with a poor mandate, and completely inadequate budgetting for maintenance or capital enhancement.

      The people working voluntarily in the public interest (who are not professional lawyers, accountants, engineers, photographers, etc) to try to remedy this disastrous circumstance deserve a little more support than your constant nit-picking.

      Why not try to make yourself useful?

      Reply
  41. admin  September 23, 2011 at 5:11 pm

    Lots of nice new pics added for you above Colin. Enjoy !!

    Reply
  42. admin  September 23, 2011 at 5:18 pm

    Ive been told that the collapse of that wall has cost 1.8m to repair and that Yorkshire water want the money back of sbc. Also there is supposedly some large claims for subsidence of buildings on sandgate.

    Reply
  43. Cliff Street  September 23, 2011 at 9:19 pm

    There are many complaints about SBC made by many complainers on this site but little (nothing actually) to suggest a credible solution to the many issues raised.

    It seems that most contributors desire action and change. What appears to be most needed is a lesson. I know this wont go down well but believe me I’ve got the town’s best interests at heart and it grieves me to see the wasted effort being put in. Unless certain truths are recognised the real causes of the problems will remain hidden. Unless the causes are unearthed they cannot be addressed and so will remain active.

    It is simply stupid to pour out a tirade of ill-informed abuse, suggesting every one, from the town hall cat up, is corrupt as is the regular habit of one frequent (over frequent) contributor and some others at times. What do you think people on the receiving end of such garbage do with it? The sad fact is that when, on the extremely rare occasions, he does get something right its hidden amongst a load of bile and rubbish.

    Like most contributors I believe that Whitby fares badly under SBC. This is not because of corruption or any intention to take money away from Whitby and spend it on Scarborough. Its simply down to ignorance of the towns real and daily needs amongst those who advise on, and make, policy. There is a reason for this and I will explain it later.

    Its not unusual for inhabitants of parts of boroughs up and down the country to raise issues of neglect and feel that their area is receiving less that its share of the cake. As in the case of Whitby, they are often correct but shortages of funds in local authorities is not a new phenomenon and everyone has something to complain about.

    There are some quite shocking situations. Take the Esk Valley and surrounding area. What do they get from SBC for their Council Tax? Bins emptied and not much else. Schools, roads and social services are NYCC and planning is NYMNP. What would you say about paying about 50 quid a week to have your bin emptied.

    The reasons for inequality in resource allocation are many and varied but virtually never down to corruption. The common denominator is politics. People who wish to see things improve in their areas must realise that they are dealing with politics and politicians and so must engage in politics. All other approaches will fail.

    There is a common complaint that Whitby receives less than its share of the budget and that Councillors gleefully rub their hands at the prospect of milking Whitby to spend it on Scarborough. I’m sure this allegation is not true. (Readers should note here, however, that there is a large, very significant, cumulative and unappreciated diversion of wealth away from the town to Scarborough that has built up since 1974. This indirectly causes most of the dissatisfaction aired on this site.)

    Ask yourself a number of questions:

    1. Where do all the decision makers and their senior advisors live and work and what impact does this have on their perceptions of the local environment?
    2. How many times a year do the very top people walk about Whitby and see and feel its needs versus how many times a day do they walk about Scarborough and see and feel its needs?
    3. Are the answers to the two questions above likely to influence their focus?
    4. What about our Whitby SBC Councillors? Do they have any power and ability and are they prepared to use it? (We may have a couple of astute ones but there are others about whom the kindest comment would be “they’re well meaning”). Given the nature of the way councils operate today with an all powerful Cabinet and most of the other councillors merely nodders its not possible for an elected member, able or not, to have any real influence unless they toe the line and get a senior cabinet position.
    5. Has the rate at which things in Whitby have deteriorated coincided with the gradual transference of all senior influential posts (and most others for that matter) to Scarborough?

    It is evident that people can’t run the show in Whitby without greater awareness of the issues. This can only be gained by senior people in every department being here and being here regularly. Not just travelling here for a meeting and then leaving but people walking to work and going out and about at lunch times. This is why Scarborough receives the attention. The senior officers are a captive audience they see and feel what’s needed there but they don’t see what’s required here.

    To achieve the necessary change is a big ask but it can be done. The technology now available together with current organisational trends makes the current SBC strategy of centralisation outdated and backward looking. The changes required to improve the service are obvious and will not be achieved by the approaches that have been previously adopted.

    As I said its all about politics not about firing off letters or publishing comments on web sites, particularly offensive ones that merely get the treatment they deserve.

    If people were prepared to look there is a way of tackling this. I would start by looking at the composition of the Council and how the balance of power might be altered. Put pressure on the local tories.

    Returning to the Esk Valley, I would suggest that most senior officers don’t know where most of the Esk Valley villages are. How many top brass at the Town Hall, if challenged, could drive to Westerdale for example, without the use of a map? They wouldn’t need to of course unless it was to empty the bins.

    Reply
    • J.S.Fawcett  September 24, 2011 at 9:07 am

      Well, Cliff, you have come up with nearly a thousand words of blather there, with only one bit of new information. Unfortunately, incorrect. Council tax is only about twenty-five quid a week, not fifty. So much for your informed opinion.

      Reply
    • Ian Victa  September 29, 2011 at 2:26 pm

      What about our Whitby SBC Councillors? Do they have any power and ability and are they prepared to use it?
      Cliff, you might want to ask yourself “Who is currently the Cabinet member for Finance?”

      Reply
  44. Peter allitt  September 24, 2011 at 2:34 am

    It is a complete disgrace. Whitby is one of the UK’s foremost holiday destinations for short breaks and weekends away.
    Apart from this, Whitby residents pay their council tax like everybody else. Scarborough Borough council should be ashamed for allowing such neglect but we should not be surprised.
    It is time Whitby stood up for itself and rejected all claims by the Algerinos and became independant.

    Reply
  45. Colin Winspear  September 24, 2011 at 10:48 am

    I may not be a Structural Engineer, I may not be an expert in many things. But I do have a grasp of the English language, which it seems is lacking in others. At no time have I said that the dredging was not responsible for the collapse of the wall. What I have repeatedly said, is the photo claiming to be of the dredger doing the actual dredging that caused the collapse. With the statement underneath ” Dredging Close To The Harbour Wall Prior To Its Collapse” WAS TAKEN AFTER THE WALL WAS REPAIRED. Which is plain to see if you took the time to have a proper look. As for my constant nit picking, I will carry on doing so if I see things that are misleading, deliberate or otherwise. I have also said many times, that I fully support the cause, just not the some of the ways it’s being put across.

    Reply
  46. Colin Winspear  September 24, 2011 at 4:47 pm

    As an afterthought, I would still very much like an answer to the question I asked earlier as to the age of the photos? For some reason, it was misread, which can only explain why I received a lecture on SBCs shortcomings instead. how much it cost, legal fees etc. I thought it was a fairly easy simple question, if you don’t know, (apart from the one with a date on it) say so.. simple
    I am only following the example set by others before me, in wanting the right answer, and badgering until I get one that satisfies me. But seem to be up against people who are as evasive as the politicians they chase.

    Reply
  47. Tom Brown  September 24, 2011 at 4:57 pm

    Hello Colin well said but is distraction a good idea?

    Reply
  48. Cliff Street  September 24, 2011 at 5:00 pm

    Well Mr Fawcett you’ve demonstrated admirably the problem of people firing off insults whilst simultaneously displaying their ignorance.

    Band G Council tax payers (over £160,000 value) pay £49.66 per week equivalent whilst band H (Over £320,000) Pay £59.59.

    A great number of rural properties far exceed these values.

    Perhaps it would serve you well to read and try to understand what I said!

    Reply
  49. Colin Winspear  September 24, 2011 at 6:07 pm

    Hello Tom, thanks but I’m sorry I don’t understand what you mean by distraction?

    Reply
  50. admin  September 24, 2011 at 6:37 pm

    Hi Col, not quite sure why your like a dog with a bone. The pictures are my fault. I was sent hundreds of them and amongst them was one or 2 showing the dredging before the collapse and some showing the dredging after the collapse. As I wasn’t too familiar with the story at the time (remember this page was initially published well over a year ago) I grabbed a picture from the bunch and used it. Ok its the wrong picture, and now, on a saturday night Im gonna go down my mates and get the right picture just to keep you happy. The main thing that anyone reading this needs to remember is that the sbc report (Which Tom Brodrick fought hard to get into the public domain) clearly startes that the harbour wall collapse was due to dredging to close to the wall. This is FACT and not linked in any way to my choice of pictures for this topic. Hope that clears a few things up.

    Reply
  51. Colin Winspear  September 24, 2011 at 7:12 pm

    Thank you Admin for your concise answer, I appreciate it. I also appreciate how busy you are on this project. It would be of even more help if you were to remove the complete set of photos regarding the wall. as they are now irrelevant and no longer under the “Falling Down” category. However a little proof reading before publication might be of help.
    As for keeping me happy, that is a little harsh, all I am trying to do is clear up things that might mislead people from out of town. Being a dog with a bone is sometimes the only way to get things done.
    Again thank you,

    Reply
  52. Jack Corner  September 25, 2011 at 4:49 pm

    Colin
    Tell us what you have done for any council regards campaigning.
    We seem to be doing more to keep you happy when we really should be concentrating on saving the piers.
    Why don’t you give people a break, you are not the site administrater for the Facebook site.

    Reply
  53. admin  September 25, 2011 at 7:26 pm

    Hey colin, you wouldnt believe the trouble youve caused me. Went to get the pic off Tom. Ended up in the pub till 2 this morning. Anyway. Got your pic up. I guess your gonna ask me to take it off now I went to the trouble of getting it for you.

    Reply
  54. Colin Winspear  September 26, 2011 at 11:10 am

    Wow, isn’t it awful when someone is as tenacious as yourselves in getting to the bottom of something? But not necessarily the way you wish. By your own admission Admin, this page was initially published over a year ago, and you were unfamiliar with the story. You have held your hands up to posting some photos as being a mistake, which is admirable. By that time, the subject I am concerned with, was already over 2 years old. By it’s very title, this page is Whitby Town IS Falling Down. Not Whitby Town is Falling Down But Some Bits Have Been Sorted But We Will Highlight Them Anyway Because We Don’t Like SBC. Every photo regarding the collapse of the wall, has no place on this particular page anymore. I agree wholeheartedly that is was the fault of SBC and they should pay up. The majority of the photos do back up the subject, and the questions raised. Just not those in particular and 95% of the people I have spoken to. agree. As for your question Mr Corner, I haven’t done any campaigning for any council. I have however, spent 13 year of my life in an organisation that defends our current rights. One being the Freedom Of Speech, it seems odd that you wish to deny me mine. I know I am not an Admin for the Facebook page, but I will speak out if I see something wrong. It comes as no surprise to me, that the traits so admired in some individuals here, used to chase down the truth. Are an annoyance when used against them. Tom has recently posted some great photos of the pier in its’ current state. I will applaud him for them when I go back on there. The beauty of being an internet magazine is, it can be updated within seconds, and any concerns dealt with. As journalists it is your responsibility to ensure that the facts are put across in a proper manner, keeping in time with current matters. The sentiment is genuine, and to be admired, but please, bring the page up to date.

    Reply
  55. Jack Corner  September 29, 2011 at 5:33 pm

    Colin
    Self appraisal is no appraisal.
    We all serve our country to the best of our ability, from bricklayers to miners, from firemen to postmen.
    There are risks and deaths in all industries.
    Self appraisal is no appraisal mate, don’t forget it.
    You have not got a single clue what any of us do for a living.
    But I’ll tell you this, we all work very hard despite our efforts in upholding hard won democracy.
    We are not retired young on gold plated pensions provided from ALL of our taxes.

    Reply
  56. Colin Winspear  October 6, 2011 at 10:55 am

    Mr Corner, I recently attended the funeral of a young man, who I wish could have retired with “a gold plated pension”. Though where you get that idea from baffles me. I also paid taxes, so in effect, I was paying my own wages every month, and adding to my pension. Which I don’t get for another 5 years, and have to go cap in hand to a civilian agency to be granted it. Your remarks are nothing more then an insult.

    Reply
  57. Tom Brown  October 6, 2011 at 12:15 pm

    On the subject of working hard, we had a letter in the Gazette abusing Ken Graham (a seriously hard worker) and citing Yorkshire Forwards Chief Exec as a hard worker. AAh I nearly choked on me tea laughing.
    I visited China a few years ago and witnessed people working, I’ve seen nothing like it, everyone going non stop without work aids. Lets face it you have to go some to claim to be a hard worker in this country.

    Reply
  58. Trizia Norris  October 6, 2011 at 5:12 pm

    I have just found this website by accident and I have to say, it is certainly a lot more ‘real’ than the Gazette.

    I have been visiting Whitby at least once a year since 1997 and I am appalled at the state the town has got into in that time – it should be a national scandal that SBC have let things get so bad.

    Reply
  59. Cllr Tom Brown  October 12, 2011 at 12:36 pm

    The bridges over to both piers are not amenities they are an essential means of reaching the extensions in order to throw a life belt or to give help to casualties in the water. In this respect they must be replaced now.

    Reply
  60. D Walker  November 1, 2011 at 7:23 pm

    From West Yorkshire. We stopped visiting Whitby several years ago because it was rapidly becoming a dump. All of the stuff on the website – the complaints, petition etc, serve to underline that view. Whitby has so much to offer but has now become a drab, miserable, run-down place to visit, and has lost all sense of its history and identity. Captain James Cook must be turning over in his grave. All of those responsible for such a miserable state of affairs should be ashamed of themselves.

    Reply
  61. Colin Winspear  November 4, 2011 at 3:49 pm

    I attended the recent Town Council meeting, where MR Ian Anderson was to present a report concerning the Harbour Wall. Sadly he was not able to do this, as a member of the public turned it into a hatchet job. At one point during one attempt to answer a question, 3 members wandered round the panel, handing out cartoons. I now know this to be the cartoon in another article on here, lampooning Mr Anderson. On another attempt, the previous member of public, again wandered around the room with a laptop to show a councilor some fotos, (They apparently relevant to the question) What could have taken 10 mins or so, was dragged out to almost 30, it felt like longer. Although the members of public in question, don’t formally claim to speak for the whole of Whitby Folk, if they did, it wouldn’t be for me. I hope that Mr Anderson doesn’t see all of Whitby in the same light.. I was also astonished to see the said 3 members, rush out just before Mr Anderson, I would guess to ambush, but that is a guess, not to be taken as fact. I was appalled at the behaviour of these people, it is no surprise that many meetings are held behind closed doors, On a personal note, I understand Mr Anderson to be a highly intelligent man. No doubt the holder of a Law Degree. So if he can see that their arguments are supported by misleading and inaccurate information. It makes someone as thick, ignorant and whatever other names I have been branded on here, so much better. As I have said the very same thing. It baffled me, that when one of the most outspoken people on these forums. Was given the opportunity to ask about The Piers, or the Footbridge. He spoke about lighting up the Abbey Steps with pumpkin lanterns. Probably a very good idea, but what a wasted chance for him to speak up.

    Reply
  62. Cliff Street  November 6, 2011 at 8:14 am

    Well said Mr Winspear,

    Its refreshing to see someone on this site who is interested in accuracy and fair and factual comment. I’ve said before that there are too many people who simply suffer blind prejudice against SBC. As a result their comment, as often as not insulting and occasionally defamatory, is largely ignored. They achieve nothing.

    I’m no lover of SBC but I am a pragmatist and I know that the approach adopted by some of the people to which I suspect you refer is a waste of time. I think they’re playing a game. They surely can’t believe they’re going to change anything.

    I commented on this site some months ago about the problems and the solution . There was no sensible response. In fact the only response came from one J H Fawcett who, putting his foot straight in his mouth, demonstrated the common penchant for making comments about something of which he clearly knew nothing.

    Regards

    Cliff

    Reply
  63. Tom Brown  November 6, 2011 at 10:18 am

    This debate is looking good, it is better to see something positive in SBC than to totally blank it. I believe that there are decent democratic people within St Nicholas Street. However if the cap fits wear it because those decent people dare not voice their opinions. There is a virus in the borough and its called ‘Strategy Direction’

    Reply
  64. Pete Cowood  November 20, 2011 at 12:33 am

    I note from a recent broadcast (in Australia) of the programme ‘Towns’that Scarborough instigated a system where local projects competed for funds via an information night & visitor voting. Apparently this ensures that local funds are spent on local projects as the locals wish it to be, seems a brilliant idea. I noticed that two ex mayors of Scarborough both suggested it helped drive progress. Maybe they should set up the same thing for a Whitby budget?

    Hope it improves as I have very fond memories of Whitby as a superb town in my pre migration days.

    Reply
  65. terri groves  March 4, 2012 at 6:02 pm

    some grate pictures but it would help to show what has been reapaired and changed sine they were taken as i know for a fact that the cliff lift is perfectly ok and the seeting in st marys has been repaired and replaced too.

    Reply
  66. Tammy Fishpool  March 5, 2012 at 5:30 pm

    Has Colin not read the opening paragraph, where it clearly states some of the pictures are from 2010 and repairs may have taken place. Colin Ive read a lot of your comments here, on the facebook page and on the Gazette site and you come across as more of a trouble maker than the people you are constantly accusing of being trouble makers. You do realise that your not painting yourself in a very positive light ? Never argue with a fool online as the people reading will see you both as fools.

    Reply
  67. Anthony Littlewood  March 5, 2012 at 5:37 pm

    I would agree with Tammy as Colin does come across as a real nit picker. Im sure he doesnt actually engage brain before posting, let alone actually read the things he is commenting about.

    Reply
  68. Terri Groves  March 5, 2012 at 7:57 pm

    did you actually read the whole thread properly, too, Mr Littlewood?

    a reasonable point was raised (the picture of the dredger can’t have been taken before the wall callapsed as you can see the repair) so what is wrong with that? i don’t see that there’s been any move to correct such a obvious mistake i cant see why the site would want to be seen as deliberately lying which there mistake comes across as at the moment as its been months since the probelm of a minor mistake has been blown out of preportion.

    as i said before if this is a diary page then everyhting really should be clearly date with a then and now picture as it risks making the town look worse than it is

    unless real whitby want the town to loook bad?

    Reply
    • admin  March 5, 2012 at 8:52 pm

      The town already looks bad, its falling to pieces. The list is endless : East Pier extension, closed. East Pier lighthouse, closed. West Pier Extension on a temporary bridge only wide enough for one person. West pier lighthouse, about to fall down and currently closed, ancient capstans left to rot away, buildings like the piers and lighthouses date back hundreds of years, it makes me feel so sad when I see the state we have let them get into. When I was a kid, the piers had annual maintenance, handrails were painted or oiled, timber was tarred, etc. Now look at the state of them. Come on guys surely you dont think the town is in good condition ?? The neglect is everywhere, Scarborough Borough Council have invested nothing in this town over the past twenty years. Wether you like Real Whitby, or Me, Or Nigel or anyone else for that matter, surely you can see whats right under your nose.

      Reply
  69. Anthony Littlewood  March 5, 2012 at 8:59 pm

    Sorry Colin, But when I read your comments on hear and your mad rants on facebook, you come across as a man with a personal vendetta against the site owner and contributors rather than a man with any reasoned arguments or positive critique about the articles on this website. Now I’m just saying how it looks from a laypersons point of view. Please don’t shoot the messenger. Ill leave you to chew it over. Back to you….

    Reply
  70. Terri Groves  March 5, 2012 at 9:47 pm

    the point i was trying to make is that if you are going to document things then you should to do it properly because it just looks like the repairs have never been made. take all the pictures of the seats for instance a lot of those have now been replaced with the green memorial benches

    show pictures ‘then’ and ‘now’ and let people see whats happened and let them judge. why cannt you do that?

    by the way the capstans arent that old as the originals on the west pier were ripped out to make way for the traintracks and works laid down to build the extensions. possibly the same for the west too but i remember my great-great-uncle telling me about the east ones when i was little as he worked on them

    Reply
  71. admin  March 5, 2012 at 11:12 pm

    That would still make them roughly 100 years old I guess ?? You seem to have a lot of knowledge on these things Terri. Maybe you could consider writing a piece for us ? Were always looking for articles for the site and I would love to have more historical type stuff on the site. We already have a category for history, but not many articles or writers

    http://www.real-whitby.co.uk/category/at-whitby/history-2/

    Reply
  72. Terri Groves  March 6, 2012 at 12:00 am

    if you really want a proper history of them then you really need to contact David Pybus via the civic society as he is the recognized expert on them. i missed his talk earlier this year, but having heard him talk about them last year its amazing just how they have grown and changed and perhaps even done the town more harm than good as they drasstically changed how the sea affected the cliffs and the natural dredging for wont of a better term of the harbour mouth

    I have been trying to remember the name of a nice young man who did a talk in 2009 about the railways coming into the town and how much resistance there was and then how much that was used against the town when the Beeching cuts took them away again. i’ll see if i can find the details as it wasn’t a local talk focused on here but one held in London as part of a bigger event about industrial herritage and the postwar and Beeching changes.

    Will you be addresssing the problem of not showing where work has been done, please, as I feel you are accidentally giving the wrong impression of the town when you don’t. we need more people to come here these days not less and our lovely town deserves to be shown at her best where ever she can.

    Reply
  73. Terri Groves  March 6, 2012 at 12:13 am

    my husband has just reminded me that that one of the things Mr Pybus said in his talk was that when the extensions were built there expected life was 75 years at the most before they would need to be replaced or completely rebuilt if they were going to be kept at all and that the long lost groyns should have been a higher priority to be kept,

    Reply
  74. Amelia Jenson  March 6, 2012 at 11:40 am

    I wondering what makes you think you have a right to be replied to Mr Winspeare. Real Whitby may be wrong in publishing your emails but why should they reply to you. All your emails appear to be childish rants and demands on how you think they should run their site and facebook. I would bin them all and ban your email address, I would probably report you to your Internet service Provider too. Im thinking if you dont like your emails published you should stop sending them and if you want your thoughts and views to be on the internet you should build your own website, Im sure it would be read by a great many people.

    Reply
  75. Craig Natress  March 6, 2012 at 11:42 am

    Why are Real Whitby letting this man take over the site. His comments are becoming a bore, cut him off for gods sake. Has he anything positive to contribute, I doubt it very much. The site would be better with him gone.

    Reply
  76. Terri Groves  March 6, 2012 at 3:44 pm

    All I see Ms Jenson and Mr Natress is someone being bullied by the site on facebook for simply pointing that there are a few errors and accidental misrepresentations on the page tahat could hvae easily been correct without all this rather childish behavior on both parts

    however i do belieeve it was contemptible to pubilish an email address when this site says that your personal information is safe with them

    Reply
  77. Amelia Jenson  March 6, 2012 at 5:38 pm

    Ok, you win. I think your never going to be wrong Colin Winspear, in your own head that is. Havent got time for people like you in my day so wont be commenting again.

    Reply
  78. Anthony Littlewood  March 6, 2012 at 5:42 pm

    Hello, Terry. If someone is being bullied on Facebook then I would report it as I know they take that type of thing very very seriously. However Ive been watching the facebook page and all Ive seen is Real Whitby publishing Mr Winspeares emails, they have made no comment about them and as far as I see have made no bullying or harrassment type comments about him, infact they have ignored them completely. Surely the best way to stop that is for Mr Winspeare to stop sending emails, wouldnt you say.

    Reply
  79. Steve Arnold  March 6, 2012 at 6:16 pm

    I came across your website from a Google search and I have read most of the comments on here and some of the stuff on Facebook. I have to say, as a potential visitor to Whitby, it doesn’t show the town in a very good light. Why would you have a website that highlights your town’s WORST features? Why would you then use that website to have a public slanging match? It certainly puts me off visiting. Don’t forget that this is the WORLD WIDE web. Many, many people are reading your public argument. You really should stop it.

    Reply
  80. Andrea Smith  March 6, 2012 at 7:44 pm

    Its funny how two people can look at the same website and see 2 totally different things. I too found this website via a google search after being recommended to look at the sites winter snow pictures. I then looked through all the sites photographs in the numerous gallery pages and have to say they are some of the best pictures of Whitby and North Yorkshire that I have ever seen. Was I put off visiting Whitby by this website ? Well how trivial would that be, if anything I am inspired to return time and again. Why not look beyond what you first see here. Of course if you are a negative person you will be drawn to arguments like the one youre now involved in. If your a positive person you will see many fantastic things on this fabulous website. Is your glass half full or half empty Steve.

    Reply
    • Colin Winspear  March 7, 2012 at 11:10 am

      I totally agree with you Miss Smith, there are some really well written and thought provoking articles on here, I have said the same on numerous comments I have made. I even replied to one of them, congratulating the author on her story.

      Reply
  81. Cliff Street  March 6, 2012 at 8:14 pm

    There are people who use this site claiming their interest is to improve the town, its infrastructure and its environs who instead are clearly trying to mislead us all. These people almost always attribute all the problems to the evil SBC and its Officers.

    It would appear, in fact, that their true objective is to cause trouble for SBC with some ill-conceived idea that it will help drive an even bigger wedge between local townsfolk and the borough council.

    Their goal is to try and split Whitby from SBC. Well, there’s not a snowball’s chance that this will happen!

    If improvements are the goal, then a constructive and balanced approach is required.

    I don’t agree with everything Mr Winspear says but he is correct in pointing out errors and insisting that what is published is factually correct.

    As this sad fiasco unfolds it appears that sets of pictures have been cobbled together to make or reinforce points. Some are out of date yet purport to show problems that existed at the time of publication. Whether this was intentional mischief or mere sloppiness it is, nevertheless, clearly misleading. Mr Winspear discovered this and highlighted it.

    Some people clearly dislike the truth if it falls to support their argument.

    My advice Mr Winspear is to carry on the good work. Make people think before opening their mouths. If this site’s editorial policy was tightened up it may gain at least some credibility amongst the wider public instead of the derision with which it is often viewed at present.

    The idea is good the execution is piss poor.

    Cliff

    Reply
  82. admin  March 6, 2012 at 8:35 pm

    Further to Andrea’s comment above. Just looking at the site stats, its the politics type subjects that draw the most comments. It appears that people really do love these types of articles in terms of site user discussion that is. On the other hand, the articles which draw the most views seem not to be the politics articles, it seems the pictures and general interest topics draw the most views and generally those people don’t get drawn into the debate on the politics side of the site.

    Makes for interesting viewing :

    http://www.real-whitby.co.uk/whats-popular/

    Reply
  83. Colin Winspear  March 7, 2012 at 11:07 am

    Thank you Miss Groves and Cliff Street for your comments.
    Admin, are stats the only thing you are concerned about then, not the truth?
    Miss Jenson, may I ask you two questions? Are the opinions about the above rants your own, or at the request of Admin? I see the deliberate addition of the “e” to my name, a tactic oft used by admin as he knows it riles me.
    Last I attended the WTC monthly meeting, two items on the agenda were the Closure of the Lighthouse, and The Rock Armour proposal. I would like to know, if those two subjects are of such great concern to this site and its Facebook offshoots? Why were my brother and I the only members of the public there?

    Reply
  84. Andrea Smith  March 7, 2012 at 5:26 pm

    “Why were my brother and I the only members of the public there? ”

    Well I was out with my boyfriend and our lovely children for a meal. Socialising is Something you should try Colin, it is good for you and might help you be a little less uptight at times.

    Reply
  85. Anthony Littlewood  March 7, 2012 at 5:28 pm

    Same old, Same old Colin. Just like on the gazette website you always have to be right and have the last word. YAWN YAWN YAWN

    Reply
  86. Harrold Locker  March 7, 2012 at 8:21 pm

    Real Whitby regularly raise the problem that there’s not enough people in the town going to the Public Meetings. Quite rightly, too. The more members of the public that attended as many meetings as they can helps ensure that our elected officials work openly, fairly, and with the best interest of the town at heart.

    So why is attending these meetings something to be mocked and vilified?

    PS – This may be a double post. I tried earlier but it appears to have not posted,

    Reply
    • admin  March 7, 2012 at 8:42 pm

      Thanks Harold, I got your double post, so I deleted the other. Welcome to the site and thanks for the valued contribution you just made. It would be nice to see more people at the meetings, on the other hand we cant all make them all due to busy lives with family, children, social and work commitments. Not attending should not be a crime either, we all do what we can when we can.

      Reply
  87. Terri Groves  March 8, 2012 at 6:17 pm

    i too find it hard to understand why going to the meetings is something to be laughed at as as Mr Locker has said its something that should be done by more more often.

    Mr Littlewood I would request that you grant me the curtosy of spelling my name correctly. My name is ‘Terri’ and not “Terry”

    when you post on here it says “Your email address will not be published” and the site policy has a statement “Real Whitby is committed to ensuring that your privacy is protected. Should we ask you to provide certain information by which you can be identified when using this website, then you can be assured that it will only be used in accordance with this privacy statement.” so do you not understand why some people find it contemptible and unseemly that this privacy has been broken?

    Reply
  88. Amelia Jenson  March 9, 2012 at 4:03 pm

    Lets stick to the facts Colin. I suggested that Real Whitby contact your Internet service Provider because you are using their service to send “UNWANTED” messages to the real whitby email address (quoted from facebook). This could be seen as malicious use of your internet connection and in breach of your contract with your ISP. Now it would appear you are using this sites comments system to attack the site owner, his family, and some of the site authors such as Nigel ward. Indeed I would report you for illegal use of your internet services as I dont think you should be allowed to behave this way.

    Reply
    • Colin Winspear  March 15, 2012 at 2:44 pm

      Of course my emails are “unwanted”, who would want to be told they’re rubbish at what they do day in day out? Yet they post them anyway, though they are edited and manipulated to suit the site when they are. So go ahead Real-Whitby, contact my ISP and have me barred from the internet entirely, show them your evidence, even the bits you made up.

      Reply
      • Andrew Newsom - Admin  March 15, 2012 at 2:57 pm

        Colin I have been recruited by Real Whitby to assist with keeping discussion on topic. The first thing I have done is to add your email address to the Real Whitby Gmail Spam Filter. Also I must tell you that this is your last off topic comment to the site.

        Reply
  89. Amelia Jenson  March 10, 2012 at 2:39 pm

    I feel this site does not seek to speak on my behalf, It offers a point of view and it awards us a means to speak on our own behalves through this comments area, which you and I are both currently doing.

    Reply
  90. admin  March 10, 2012 at 2:51 pm

    We offer our readers the right to become site contributors. There are 3 ways people can contribute:

    1. You can comment on the stories.
    2. You can write letters for the arguments yard section
    3. If you have a specific area of interest you may write and submit articles to be published.

    With regards to the site stats, yes I am very interested in them, it shows me the site is popular and gives me a good idea of what type of articles our readers enjoy the most. We currently have roughly 8000 individual readers per month. I feel we must be doing something right.

    Reply
  91. Anthony Littlewood  March 10, 2012 at 3:01 pm

    Its very amusing. All these people who dont like what they see on their screens, but they come back everyday for an update. Its like watching TV. You dont like what you see then turn it over or even turn it off. Some people are very odd.

    Reply
  92. admin  March 10, 2012 at 3:48 pm

    Whitby Town Is Falling Down 3937 view(s) (March 2012)

    Reply
  93. Harold Locker  March 14, 2012 at 8:14 pm

    Your photo captioned “East Pier Bridge Still Missing Summer 2011″ was actually taken in 2009 according to the embedded photo data., as was “Broken Benches In St Mary’s Graveyard At Whitby Summer 2011″

    Many others labelled 2011 and yet are actually from 2009 and a few from 2007.

    So either you’re terrible at an editorial policy on keeping the pages factual, timely and correct, or deliberately maliciously misleading people?

    Reply
    • Jane Swales  March 14, 2012 at 8:48 pm

      “Ye blind guides, which strain at a gnat, and swallow a camel”. Matthew 23:24 [King James Bible].

      Reply
  94. Jolene Greaves  March 14, 2012 at 8:26 pm

    Exif Data from a camera is very unreliable Harold/chris/colin as it depends on the camera having been set to the correct time and date. Best policy is to take a look with ones own eyes. As the east pier bridge is currently missing, I assume it was also missing in 2011 unless of course it was rebuilt then knocked down again just to make you correct in this instance, which given your special powers is not beyond the realms of possibility..

    Reply
  95. Terri Groves  March 15, 2012 at 3:07 pm

    Off Topic nonfactual comment removed by Andrew. No-one is barred from this website. On topic and factual comments are welcomed.

    Reply
  96. EDGAR VILLAS  March 16, 2012 at 1:06 am

    IS THIS WOT WHITBY REALLY LOOKS LIKE? WE WOS GOING TO VISIT FOR GOTH WEEKEND FOR MY STAG DO BUT IF THIS IS IS THE CRAP HOLE IT LOOKS LIKE I THINK WELL GIVE IT A MISS THNK YOU

    Reply
  97. Carmen A Sturdy  March 16, 2012 at 7:13 am

    I was in Leeds yesterday, in a restaurant in the Calls area, when I overheard a conversation between two couples. One of the women announced that they had been looking for a weekend away and had been thinking about Whitby. She’d been looking on the web, however, and found comments and pics on a Whitby site saying that it was crap and in a shocking state nowadays.

    They’d decided not to come and instead booked somewhere else. You’ll never guess where they’re going now.

    Clue! Its a place about 20 miles away down the coast.

    Good work Real Whitby!

    Reply
    • admin  March 16, 2012 at 3:45 pm

      Thanks for the good news, it appears that our strategy of targeting various keywords through Google is effective and people far and wide are now finding our site and reading the articles. Indeed our site stats are reflecting just that. Its always been a goal of the site to take Real Whitby into the living rooms and lives of people across the UK and indeed across the world (Again weve had comments from as far away as New Zealand about the neglect that Whitby is seeing). I hope the couple you overheard enjoy their stay in Scarborough with all its quaint and historical attractions. I wonder if one of the couple is Edgar Villas who only yesterday commented on the site saying they had decided to stay away because of this very article. Strange coincidence that.

      Reply
      • Colin Winspear  March 16, 2012 at 4:22 pm

        So, am I to understand that you are quite happy Admin, that people are avoiding Whitby based on the way it is portrayed on sites such as this, containing articles such as this one? As long as people are visiting the site?

        Reply
        • admin  March 16, 2012 at 5:11 pm

          Personally I dont care either way Colin. If people want to come to Whitby they will and if they dont then they will go elsewhere. Im sure the town will still continue to bust at the seems everytime the sun shines regardless of anything this site says, I mean, why wouldnt it, its one of the most beautiful towns in the country, set right on the edge of a stunning national park with coastline that would be unrivaled in most places across the world. Its the natural beauty and the history that people come to see, and despite the best efforts of the council they will never be able to take away what nature and history has created..

          Reply
      • Richard Johnson  March 25, 2012 at 7:09 pm

        That is a very high handed attitude to have admin, Google is a search engine set to find keywords on any current operating site, I doubt that you can claim to have conceived the words “Whitby and Real” to attract Googles attention.

        Reply
        • admin  March 25, 2012 at 8:21 pm

          Hi Col / Chris each page on the site targets a set of keywords or keyphrases. By use of keywords in H1 tags, keywords in urls, alt tags on images, page title tags each page is optimised on page and interlinked throughout various pages on the site. Whitby and real is not a keyphrase we target but we do target several thousand identified keywords throughout the site to draw in readers from Google and other search engines. Once people are on the site we then use strategically placed links, in the sidebar and under headings like further reading to guide them to significant site articles like this one amongst others. Its a long term strategy, well researched, and perfectly legal. Search Engine Optimisation (SEO) is something Ive studied for about 6 years in depth, and through time this site will reap the benefits of that.

          Reply
    • Al Roberts  March 17, 2012 at 5:28 pm

      Shame on Real Whitby, if its you that’s to blame for the wessies pestering us here at Scarboro, you should at least accept your fair share!

      Reply
  98. Carmen A Sturdy  March 16, 2012 at 7:17 am

    Just read my previous post and am afraid it might be interpreted as encouraging people to avoid stating the truth. Far from it. I merely want to point out that the outcome of comments may not always be what people hope and intend.

    It makes sense to consider the approach very carefully if you are seeking to achieve change.

    Reply
  99. EDGAR VILLAS  March 16, 2012 at 5:03 pm

    HAHA! I CN PROMISE U I WONST IN LEEDS YESTERDAY!! LMFAO!

    Reply
  100. admin  March 16, 2012 at 5:17 pm

    Site growing daily as is the readerships. This site is going to be massive. we are determined to make it The biggest and best in Whitby.

    Content
    688 Posts
    32 Pages
    56 Categories
    624 Tags

    Discussion
    2,918 Comments

    Reply
  101. EDGAR VILLAS  March 16, 2012 at 5:23 pm

    WTF? 1ST U SAY THE TOWN FALLING DOWN AND THN U SAY ITS BEAUTIFUL? LMFAO!!!!1

    Reply
  102. admin  March 17, 2012 at 1:23 pm

    http://www.real-whitby.co.uk/whitby

    Reply
  103. Colin Winspear  March 17, 2012 at 3:09 pm

    May I ask, why the last two comments in this thread, are those aimed personally at me? Comments made since have been placed before, is this an attempt to make those comments to be the last people read before they post their own?

    Reply
  104. Harold Locker  March 22, 2012 at 6:58 pm

    Thank you for at last putting up that the pictures were taken over a period of time and taking that misleading caption off the Dredger.

    It would be great to see some side-by-side then-and-now phtoos to show what has been repaired and what’s still in need of work – the infamous East Pier connecting bridge, for instance.

    Reply
    • Colin Winspear  March 22, 2012 at 8:58 pm

      To add to Mr Lockers comment, I would like to make a suggestion, in the best of possible intentions. Would it not be wiser to scrap this particular thread and start again, given all that has gone on? As MR Locker and a few others have suggested, with before and after photos.
      That way would strike an even balance.

      Reply
      • Amanda Headlam  March 22, 2012 at 10:55 pm

        I think the topic should stay. It serves as a reminder of What Scarborough Borough Council think of Whitby. Colin must walk around with his head in the clouds. People who were brought up in the town and have lived here all their lives know that Scarborough Council spend all the money in Scarborough. But most importantly this topic should stay as it clearly annoys a very annoying man, for that reason it should be given prominence on this site from this day on.

        Reply
  105. Finger Bob  March 22, 2012 at 10:57 pm

    Haha Col wants it deleting because its full of his mad rants and he realises how silly he looks. Think before you post your repetitive rants big Col.

    Reply
    • Colin Winspear  March 24, 2012 at 3:49 pm

      I despair at the closed narrow minded mentality of the people I am ashamed to share the same town with. Is having lived here all your life the only qualification accepted to have an opinion? If as you say all the money is spent in Scarborough, who is paying for the new Footbridge, the current replacement footbridge, the work done to the near end of the East Pier? Who paid for the Coastal Strategy study that is currently seeking funding for the Pier repairs? I guess now I will be labelled a SBC lover. As for you Finger Bob at least I have the nerve to look silly under my own name and not hide behind a pseudonym.

      Reply
  106. Richard Johnson  March 25, 2012 at 7:27 pm

    Is the moose a local attraction?

    Reply
  107. admin  March 25, 2012 at 8:58 pm

    Whitby Town Is Falling Down 4169 view(s)

    Reply
  108. Dave Heselton  April 3, 2012 at 2:37 pm

    I remember been a town councillor sitting in a meeting in 1989, the item for discussion was whether to allow affordable homes for rent to be built at Saint Peters Court. The chamber had a number of protesters who had come to tell the councillors how these new homes would spoil thir view and cause traffic chaos – these protesters all lucky enough to have a nice home to live in

    When it came to the vote I was the only one who voted in favour of allowing the development, I told the protesters that my conscience would not allow me to vote against new homes while there were local families desperate for a place to live.
    At that time I realised I was wasting my time on WTC, the council was, and still is a complete joke.

    Whenever I think of Whitby Town Council I am reminded of the film “Carry on Girls” which featured the town council of “Fircombe” and councillors Mrs Prodworthy, alderman Pratt and mayor Frederick Bumble.

    Given a choice of been run by SBC or WTC, give me Scarborough Borough Council every time.

    Idealy, we ought to have had our own district council which was the original plan back in 1972.
    If the Whitby district ( and possibly areas of East Cleveland ) cannot have our own district or borough, then the next best thing would be to change the name of the borough in order to reflect the 50% of the population which does not live in Scarborough.

    As for so called “outsiders”, I have family members who drive me mad with this silly attitude.
    They say things like “he s only been in t town 5 minutes” or “he s not local, what does he know”.
    If people choose to come and live here because they want to, then whats the problem, and if those people contribute in some way to the town and community, then thats great.

    Reply
  109. Nigel Ward  April 3, 2012 at 9:05 pm

    I am hearing that the Scoresby Monument at Dock End has blown down! 9:45pm 3rd April 2012. Confirmed by Cllr Amanda Smith.

    Reply
  110. admin  April 15, 2012 at 12:26 am

    http://www.yorkshirepost.co.uk/news/around-yorkshire/local-stories/lighthouse-repairs-delayed-over-crumbling-pier-fears-1-4443661

    Repairs to Whitby’s lighthouses, which are starting to lean as a result of decay, are being delayed amid fears the historic piers are also crumbling.

    Major stabilistation work to the East and West piers may have to be carried out before any money is spent on restoring the Grade II listed buildings, which is expected to cost in the region of £200,000.

    A report, which is due to go before the Whitby Harbour Board next week, claims that even if the lighthouses were repaired, their long-term future would not be secured as the piers on which they stand are “themselves at risk”.

    Reply
  111. Hospedagem Grátis  April 20, 2012 at 2:09 pm

    Hi my friend! I want to say that this post is amazing, nice written and include almost all vital infos. I’d like to see more posts like this .

    Reply
  112. Lynda  November 14, 2012 at 9:56 am

    Whеn I initially commented I clicked the “Notify me when new comments are added” chеckbox and now each time a comment is addеd I get
    four emails with the same commеnt. Is
    there аnу way you can remove people fгom thаt servicе?
    Appreciate it!

    Reply
  113. rahjibugha  November 29, 2012 at 1:28 pm

    Yes Whitby town really is falling down. There goes Alfleda Terrace. What next, St Mary’s moving to Henrietta St?

    Reply
  114. rahjibugha  November 29, 2012 at 1:29 pm

    Sorry, AELFLEDA Terrace

    Reply
  115. Daryl Smiler  November 29, 2012 at 2:02 pm

    I suppose its all Ton Fox’s fault.

    Reply
  116. Daryl Smiler  November 29, 2012 at 2:02 pm

    Sorry ashould be Tom

    Reply
  117. rahjibugha  November 29, 2012 at 3:56 pm

    Why should Tom be sorry?

    Reply
  118. Frazer Irwin  March 29, 2013 at 4:40 pm

    Great photographs lads. I spend much of my time doing much the same over in the Wharfe valley. There’s more to Ilkley than Ilkley Moor and some of it is not that nice. But if folk don’t see it who’s going to know.

    Reply
  119. PAUL  April 8, 2013 at 11:26 am

    That is because no one cares about the shoddy little town anymore and hopefully they will rip the piers and lighthouses down will save money for where its actually needed theses items aren’t needed or used anymore except by a few saddo tourists and fishermen that aren’t real fishermen just hobby fishermen so get rid and put money to use elswhere why repair and spend money on stuff that don’t matter anymore.

    Reply
  120. Peter  November 29, 2013 at 11:16 pm

    Ilkley’s main car park with 227 spaces earns over £250,000 a year for Bradford Council. People come to Whitby and park for free all along the cliff top roads and Sandsend beach. Think of all the money we could have had over the years if we had charged tourists to park there. That money could have been invested in Whitby to stop it falling down! If I visit York, Durham, London, wherever I expect to pay to park; people come to Whitby and expect to pay for free. Sort it someone!!!

    Reply
  121. Frazer Irwin FCD  November 30, 2013 at 8:00 pm

    Fully agree about our main carpark. However we only wish we could have some of that 250K back in town to pay for the upkeep of our Manor House museum. The one Bradford are want to close. Regarding folk not being interested in Whitby, why do all those folk congregate for your Goth and Dracula weekends, if not for their love of the place.

    Have a look on Google+ for the photographers who flock to your town. Make email contact with Anchorage in Alaska again. The same goes for all the places Cook visited. Use the Web to it’s fullest and tell the world not just local folk.

    Get on their local websites and tell folk out there what is going on. Show them the photographs. Before and after. If there’s one thing I’ve learned these past thirty odd years dealing with various councils, local and Nationwide, they do not like bad publicity. It’s upto you to make Whitby a place to be proud of. You can do it.

    Reply
  122. Pingback: Real Whitby breaks journalistic ground | YCDM.ORG.UK

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whitby photography by glenn kilpatrick